Society: “You be you!” (No, not like that) Artwork

The Point of the Matter

Two women—friends for 50 years, no holding back, no bullshit, deeply southern—break down the issues that all grown-ass women deal with on the daily. We deliver not only a unique point of view, but a cocktail as well! We’re those outspoken, frank girlfriends that most women know, some women are, and many women want to be. Most off all, we're the friends every woman deserves to have in her life. So grab a cocktail...or a mocktail...we don't judge (Okay, that's a lie. We absolutely judge but never about your beverage of choice) and join in!

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The Point of the Matter

Society: “You be you!” (No, not like that)

August 27, 2021 • Stasha Boyd / Cheryl Stuller • Season 1 • Episode 16

Ever had a conversation that starts off on a normal track then veers off the highway, jumps the curb, skids across the ditch, blasts through the trees, then ends up on a totally different road careening towards a completely unknown destination? Yeah, this one’s like that.

Society is more than shared beliefs and ideas. It’s the feeling you get when you feel like you have to keep your mouth shut around certain people. It’s the feeling in the pit of your stomach when you feel like you don’t fit in, or worse, like you’re being shut out. Everyone’s felt it but a lot of people don’t see it. That invisible, relentless pressure that tells you what is okay to say, do, believe, and be. And what’s not.

Warning to the WarriorQueens: In this episode, we cross the danger lines and go deep into the red zones: masks, vaccines, atheism, racism, ageism, abortion…politics. Enter at your own risk.

(Oh, and we did this one stone cold booze free.)

Stasha's continuing her August alcohol break and has been exploring mocktails!

Stasha’s mocktail: Mint, Lime, and Ginger Sparkler

The zesty flavor of a ginger mojito without the alcohol in this long, cool, sparkling drink.

NOTE: The recipe below serves 6. For a single serving, I grate about a teaspoon or ginger, a tablespoon of fresh mint leaves, the juice of 1 lime (or .75 oz), 4 oz of Ginger beer and top with lime La Croix or Bublé.

2” of Ginger root, Fresh, shredded
1 Lime wheels and mint, sprigs
1/4 cup Mint, loosely packed fresh leaves
1/4 cup Lime juice, fresh
24 oz Ginger beer
8 oz Seltzer

In a large bowl, muddle fresh ginger, mint leaves, and lime juice. Stir in ginger beer. Strain into a pitcher, pressing down on solids. Stir in seltzer. Serve over ice with lime wheels, more ginger slices, and mint sprigs

PS—If you want to make it boozy (which is delicious!) reduce the ginger beer a bit and add 1.5 oz (per serving) of your favorite vodka or tequila.

Cheryl decided to give it a rest for the rest of the month as well and opted for hard core cold turkey, as she is wont to do. She'll be back with a recipe next week (if she feels like it)!

Stasha Boyd 00:01

Hi there, I'm Stasha

Cheryl Stuller 00:03

I'm Cheryl.

Stasha Boyd 00:05

And between us we

Cheryl Stuller 00:05

have four kids,

Stasha Boyd 00:07

three businesses,

Cheryl Stuller 00:08

two husbands and one goal:

Stasha Boyd 00:10

To get to The Point of the Matter. Because most of us just kind of wander through this this world as if you know everything, the way, the way we see things is the way things really are and ought to be. But it's like, no, not everything, not everything that you see, and that works out for you right now is good for everyone. Not every society is moving in a good direction. Not every society's rules need to be followed, some of them need to be changed, and some of them need to be discarded. But you can't do that until you can see it.

Cheryl Stuller 00:41

When you have something that you disagree on, and you bring that up with somebody else, it's not a discussion. It's not a: it's okay for you to feel differently than me. It's a: I feel entitled, I'm going to tell you how you should feel and if you don't feel the way I tell you, you should feel, then I don't like you.

Stasha Boyd 01:03

Hello, Cheryl.

Cheryl Stuller 01:05

Hello, sweet Stasha. How are you?

Stasha Boyd 01:08

I, well, let's just, let's just be honest, right from the front, I'm hot. I'm hot, Cheryl. The air conditioning went out in our office building about an hour ago and because I live in Florida, where it's bitchin hot, and my office faces West with one, three huge windows. Five foot windows facing just straight into the sun, it's hot. But that's, that's that's how I am right now. How about you?

Cheryl Stuller 01:37

This topic is going to be hot too. I can, I can see us having to do some edits on this one.

Stasha Boyd 01:44

Yeah baby. We're gonna, we're just gonna let it roll. We're gonna let it roll. Well, so how was your week? So what was, what was the week like for you?

Cheryl Stuller 01:52

My friend's memorial was on Saturday so that was a good and emotional at the same time. It's gonna be hard to not have him in my life. And I don't have a cocktail today, I'm trying not to drink this month I'm going to give myself this month to go through all of my grieving and all of that kind of stuff and I, I'm more of a I drink when I'm happy kind of person. Cause that's a slippery slope to start drinking when you're not happy so.

Stasha Boyd 02:24

And that's true. And I'm still doing my, you know, August off of the, of the low end no alcohol. So I'm at this point, I am on day 18 and have only had two drinks. One time was when we went to the party when you were down here. And then Mike and I had some wine with dinner the other night. So I'm in the mocktails. I've been actually really having kind of fun. So I've been seeking out some mocktails and this one is off of you know, my best you know, original gangster Martha Stewart. It's off her website, and it's a mint lime and ginger sparkler. So it's basically it is all fresh. So it's fresh mint, fresh ginger, grated up, muddled together, mixed with half ginger beer and half sparkling Lacroix.

Cheryl Stuller 03:10

That sounds, that sounds like a really refreshing drink. Isn't Martha Stewart, she would be somebody I'd like to interview because she has built a company from the ground up, is successful in that and can tell you how to survive prison. I mean, who has that kind of dichotomy? That's awesome.

Stasha Boyd 03:31

A prison light. And and I'm one of those people that you know, for me, it's like I have I have a mixed relationship with Martha. Um, first of all, I mean, I used to love her back in the, back of the day when she was first getting started. And then over time, as it started to get more and more focused on it's like, you know, oh, how easy and how refreshing and how easy all of this is that she would say. And then I would realize and actually Mike pointed this out one time it's like, you know, that bitch has an army of people behind her. She is paying money out the wazoo. And yet she leaves the impression with all of these poor average women, that this is just so easy. It's just so easy to throw together this bountiful table and this home cooked meal with Chateau breel and the fresh plant picked flowers out of your own garden. And he's like, you know, she's caused more women to feel inadequate by not just being straight up honest. Turn that camera around and go, it's like I want to thank all these people on my crew.

Cheryl Stuller 04:23

I agree totally. Yep. Yep. I'm with you.

Stasha Boyd 04:28

At the same time I do like her her look and her style. I definitely like you know, her, her beverages. I do like the little, the little mocktail thing that they put out. Because I think it is important, you know, um, you know, like we talked about, you know, I certainly like my cocktails, and I really enjoyed them and I plan to go back to enjoying them. But I was starting to get the impression from myself that it was becoming more of a, you know, it's five o'clock, I got to have a cocktail rather than, you know, just more of a decision. So this is actually going quite well and I took a calendar and I just wrote on it. I just printed out a blank calendar page for August, and I actually started a few days before because I'm like, you know, why wait, and I just wrote down on each day, a benefit of backing off the booze for a little while. And every morning, I get up, get on the scale, weigh in, look at my little page, check off the day before, and then you know, it kind of keeps me on track for the day.

Cheryl Stuller 05:18

Wow, that's great. I'm, you know, admiring what you're doing, because I know it's hard.

Stasha Boyd 05:24

It's hard for socializing. That's for sure. Yeah, it hasn't been hard or anything else. But just, I'm such a social person. But I'm gonna start practicing that too, you know, kind of going out with friends. And just making sure that I kind of stay on the, on the, on the path that I've chosen.

Cheryl Stuller 05:39

Yeah, I'm with you. I support you, girl.

Stasha Boyd 05:42

Thank you, baby. What would actually kind of brings us to today's topic, Cheryl? Aren't you excited about today's topic?

Cheryl Stuller 05:49

I am not sure whether I'm excited or not. We'll see based on the comments we get.

Stasha Boyd 05:56

So the topic ladies is, is society. And I actually chose this topic. And the reason that I think it's important to women, our age, women in our 50s, is because, for me, what society means is society, there's actually a really good definition that I found. Let me just kind of read this out real quick. But basically in in society refers to a group of people who live in a definable community and share the same culture. And on a broader scale, society consists of the people and institutions around us, our shared beliefs and our cultural ideas. And so to me, when everybody talks about what they say, or this pressure that they feel to conform to something, this is what they're talking about, the society they live in. If you say something out of step with the society, that's when you start to get pressure, if you do something that doesn't fit in, that's when you start to get pressure. And so I think it's important because as we've aged, a lot of women, first of all, we've been living in these societies our entire lives. And now we've gotten to the point where like, I don't want to put up with some of this shit anymore. But I don't know why I feel so bad about changing. And I don't know why people are so are so annoyed with me when I don't want to do it. So I think that's kind of the reason I think it's important.

Cheryl Stuller 07:15

I agree, I think it's a an important topic, I just, I kind of feel differently in that I don't feel that pressure to be anything other than what I am. And, and I also think that we live in such a way now that your next door neighbor, you know, it used to be that you knew everybody that lived around you. And now it can be that your next door neighbor has completely different views than you, you never talk to them. You never see them. You don't socialize with them on even just a friendly, Hey, how you doing basis, you know? I don't, either neighborhood that I live in, do I really talk to or hang out with anybody other than to just say, hey, when I'm driving by or running by. How about you? Well, you're in a different situation, because you've been in your area for a long time. And, you know, you've got a group of friends that, that you're really close to.

Stasha Boyd 08:20

Yeah, but it's, it's still a society. And we'll kind of get to this later in the conversation, when we start talking about how societies either reform themselves or split, they either evolve or they start to split, split apart into two different things. And so, so yeah, I love where I live. Now, the neighborhood I lived in before we moved here before Mike and I got married, it was the same thing. I mean, I knew the names of the people on my left and my right, but nobody else. But I didn't consider those people my society. My society was the people that I chose to hang out with. And back then before Mike and I, that was the theater. And that was where I worked at Universal Studios, and that was family and friends and that group. And so I fit into those people that was my society. And you know, in the, the theater community, the theater society, there were certain views that were okay and certain views that were not okay. And so, um, you know, I just kind of like, you know, use some of the the low hanging fruit as it were, it's like, some things are, you know, artistic expression, however, you want to express yourself, that is completely okay in that society. Um, however, if you step outside of that a little bit, and say, Yeah, but you know, as long as you're not expressing yourself in this fashion, as long as you're doing this type of theater, you know, legit theater, or if you're doing you know, basically in your face theater, then that's, that's good theater, but if you decide to do you know, one more rendition of Oklahoma, or if you decide that, you know, the height of artistry is, you know, Annie Get Your Gun or some kind of like, you know, musical from the 50s then people would be like, Yeah, no, we don't, we don't really want to hang out with you, you wouldn't fit into that society. Now where Mike and I live now, and we've lived here 20 something years, um, you know, we have, with us, it's like kinda the broader community, I mean, we're active in the town, we know, the commissioners, we know the business community, we know our neighbors, etc. Um, we used to have, like, you know, traveling dinner parties, all of that kind of stuff. Um, but even then, I don't know that I really completely fit in to that group. But at the same time, it's like, I didn't feel pushed out of it. I didn't feel you know, ostracized too much, except for that one incident that we've talked about before that had to do with the local, you know, arts community. And that was really weird. And that's kind of the thing. It's like, you know, and we'll, again, I got that later in my questions about was there ever a time when you felt like you got ostracized from society? And that's one of the one times that I did.

Cheryl Stuller 10:55

I really don't feel like I have, I and I've even began to talk openly about, you know, I don't believe in God, I don't believe there's a God, you know, um, because often, you know, we're in the south, they'll say, requesting prayers for a friend. And I'm like, still okay with that, because I can pray that your friend gets better. I'm just not praying to God for that to happen. And so I still feel okay with saying, you know, sending prayers and hugs. But I find that, um, we tend to talk less about things that we don't agree with other people on, even if it's within your same group, like politics, religion, those hot button items, I think we're not discussing those anymore, openly.

Stasha Boyd 11:51

But no, that's what I mean about society. It's like, why aren't you?

Cheryl Stuller 11:56

Well, because you know that you already don't agree with that person on that you're not going to change that person's mind. It's not going to be a productive conversation, why even bring it up? If you like everything else about that person? And I have friends like this. And so do you, if you like everything else about that person, other than their politics, then you don't talk about politics.

Stasha Boyd 12:21

Yeah. But the thing that, the thing that prevents you from talking about it, the thing that stops that, that's the society that I'm talking about, right now, the society you live in, that the when you're hanging out with those people who have such a different one? Now, if this, if society said dissent was okay, that differences were Okay, then you could absolutely talk about those things. And people would know that you had a different opinion, there might even be like a humor around it like, you know, oh, so and so over there with their, with, you know, their their liberal kind of views, we're something here more conservative here, but they won't, but there won't be any price to pay for difference. There's no price to pay if you disagree with the with society. But right now, the society is shifting. It's like, that kind of disagreement is not okay, so and so what I'm saying is that, that thing that's making you not say something right now, that's society, that's the society that you're in.

Cheryl Stuller 13:12

Okay, I gotcha. And I agree with that. I, I, this whole mask thing is a huge thing with people now. We've become so divided over wearing a mask. And I would like to remind everybody that my son lived in Thailand for three years. Over in Thailand, they wear a mask out of respect for other people, even if it's just a cold. You know, and, and over here, we're viewing masks as your freedoms are being taken away. I just don't understand that. And I don't understand that when you take, when you have something that you disagree on, and you bring that up with somebody else. It's not a discussion. It's not a: it's okay for you to feel differently than me. It's a: I feel entitled, I'm going to tell you how you should feel and if you don't feel the way I tell you, you should feel, then I don't like you. And I'm going to lash out at you verbally or even physically, we've seen people get into fights over masks. Um, that I don't understand and don't get, and I think we're shifting as a society. So that now people feel so entitled, I'm sorry, I've got a cough. People feel so entitled with their opinions, that it's not, it's now not okay to have a different opinion and voice that and have it be a calm discussion.

Stasha Boyd 14:48

Right. And I think that to me it's like I think I do understand it. I have a certain sense of understanding about it. I don't, I don't know that I would swear this is the exact truth of the matter. But I think it's because you know, societies adapt symbols. And they, um, groups like that show that you belong to the group or you don't belong to the group. So as you're adapting these symbols, you know, and like, for example, you know, rallying around the flag, you know, that used to be a shared symbol for a lot of people. But over time, it has been claimed by one group of people, or the other group of people. And they're both putting special meaning on it that disagrees with the other one, and the other one sees what they're putting on it as a, as an attack, you know, you're attacking my symbol, therefore, you're attacking my group, you're attacking my culture, my society. And so the mask has simply become one more symbol attached to this to the group. My group does not wear masks. And the other group is the other group say, Well, my group not only does wear masks, but by God, you better wear a mask. And if you don't wear a mask, you're an asshole. I look at it. And the other one says, well if you do wear a mask, you're an asshole. So you have these two groups now that have dug themselves in, I am happy to be of the opinion that it seems to say that the science seems to say that wearing a mask is effective in reducing the spread of respiratory diseases, respiratory communicable respiratory diseases, so it makes perfectly good common sense to, to wear a mask. However, there are some people for whom they have decided that whether that's true or not, it doesn't matter. It wouldn't matter at all. And because they've attached an importance to it that's based upon their identity, that's based upon the feelings of being lied to, the feelings of being talked down to. And, you know, and then when the leaders of that group, reinforce that and keep reinforcing it. Then it just gets dug in deeper and deeper and deeper. So for example, if you know, way back at the beginning of this thing, had the leadership of this entity basically said, you know, no matter what else, wear a mask, and if liberals and Democrats and independents and conservatives, if everybody had just agreed on that one thing, I think this person over here is an idiot. But you know, we all agree we should wear a mask, we would be in a lot better shape.

Cheryl Stuller 17:25

We would definitely be in a lot better shape. What about when you go into surgery? Do you not want your doctor and nurses wearing a mask?

Stasha Boyd 17:34

Yeah, but that's the challenge. It's like, yeah, yeah, when you wear one in surgery, you're talking about open wounds, you know, and where you can get bacteria straight from somebody's mouth into somebody's heart or their blood. The doctors and nurses don't wear them normally, when they're walking around the hospital. So you know, it doesn't do any good, I don't think to like, you know, when we make comparisons that don't hold up to even the most basic scrutiny. Like and for me, it's like, you know, I don't I don't like wearing masks, I hate wearing masks. But the way I solve the problem is I don't go places where I have to wear masks for an extended period of time. So I'll go to the grocery store, and I'm happy to wear my mask in the grocery store. And I'll walk around, I get my stuff and I leave. But I'm not going to go on an extended shopping trip, where I go into a store right now and try on like, you know, 15 different pairs of pants and seven different shirts and all that kind of stuff. I'm just not going to do it because I don't want to wear a mask for that long.

Cheryl Stuller 18:30

Mm hmm. I'm with you. I agree with that.

Stasha Boyd 18:32

Yeah. But that goes back to like, and again, we're getting a little bit ahead because my, my feeling is is that what happens to when when, when society starts to change, when your personal society starts to change, one of two things happen. Either one view becomes dominant, and becomes the primary view. And then all of the outliers kind of get shunted aside, and are then scorned and looked down upon. And I'll give an example of that in a minute. Or the society splits. So for example, one of the things that happened you know, in this society in the American Society back in like the, the, after world war two really was before then women shouldn't work. Women should not work outside the home, women shouldn't work at all, etc. That's men's work. When all these guys came home from the war, all the women were basically fired and sent home and the men came back in and it kind of kept that idea going. Well, in the these women who had jobs and money, they kind of wanted to keep working, some of them. So 60s they instilled that into their their daughters, 60s, 70s more and more women entered the workforce, etc. At the time society was pushing back. A lot of people were saying no, this is horrible on and on and on. But over time, our society as a whole right now, there's a few little outliers out there, but most people agree that if a woman wants to work she gets to work. Some women have to work and that's not a problem. There you go. That's just life, society changed, and people who disagree with that now are outliers. In other cases, and I think what's happening where I look at now is, we're looking at people who have this very strong view of like you said, the freedom, anti-masking anti-vaxxer, vaxxer folks. And then the other, other group, which is the, you know, absolutely everybody must wear a mask, everybody must be vaccinated everybody. And these two things, either if one becomes dominant, the other one has to have outliers, or it has to split. And I'm concerned, I think, right now that what's happening is society is splitting. Our society is splitting.

Cheryl Stuller 20:48

And I think it's become more in a violent way too, more outspoken, more demanding of this is how I feel, and you should feel the same way. And if you don't, then I'm going to do A, B, C, or D. You know, there's, there's like, actions beyond just having a discussion about it and agreeing to disagree. I don't see that we are doing that anymore. You know, and that's worrisome for me.

Stasha Boyd 21:18

Yeah. Well, I think that there are people who are trying to do that, I think that there are people who are trying to be like adults in the room again, the idea of, you know, having conversations, disagreeing but still working together. You know, you look at, and I really wasn't gonna go this far down the politics route. But this is probably the easiest way to look at it. You look at the folks like Adam Kinzinger and Liz Cheney being on the January 6 Commission, you look at the 16 senators who came around and voted for the infrastructure bill. These are people who seem to be saying things like, I disagree with this portion of this bill, or I disagree with this aspect of this thing. But I'm still gonna sit at the table, we're going to work together, we're going to come up with something palatable that we can all deal with. And that's going to move our entire society forward. That's what those folks are doing. The people who are just screaming about No, we're not going to do anything, we're not going to do this, we're not going to do that. Or, again, conversely, they're the ones who are out there saying, by golly, you know, we are going to basically, we really mean it, we really want to defund the police. We don't think they should be police anymore. Those folks exist. And those groups are getting I think, more and more pulled apart. I do think right now that the violence that's going from language into action is only coming primarily, well, I would say only, but primarily coming from one side as far as being normalized. The, I don't know if you saw the news this past weekend, but you know, the the proud boys are at it again. They were 30 feet from the LAPD office's doors, and there weren't any arrests made. They were getting in fights, beating people, one person was stabbed. All sorts of stuff is going on.

Cheryl Stuller 23:02

I did not see that. And that's another thing is that, um, it's so stressful to try and keep up with the news and see what's going on. Because it's it's all the negative things that you're seeing, just like you were just talking about what happened this past weekend. We focus on all the negative things that are going on, and that seeps into your normal day to day life. And it can make you depressed, it can make you go what what are we becoming? Are there any good people left that are in leadership that can lead us into a more neutral state where we can sit down into a room and listen to somebody else's opinion. And that be okay. And normal?

Stasha Boyd 23:51

Here's the thing, I think absolutely there are, absolutely there are. And I think that you know, you look at the the ones that are out there right now. Again, it's like the the, I would say, you look at Mitt Romney, you look at Joe Biden, you look at some of these folks who are able to have conversations, and they're and they're trying to tug normalcy back into the world. And the hard part about that is like to try and get people to be excited about mundane things. That's hard. If you really want to get people fired up, which is getting them fired up to go vote, then you've got to make it matter you've got to make them afraid. And that's what the the a lot of the polsters, or not the posters but the politicians have a tendency to do is they focus on that. And then it gets amplified through social media, which is its own little you know, and that brings up something else about society. The way social media works is it starts reinforcing what you already do. So every time you click like, every time you pause your phone looking at a picture, every time you're on a screen. Those things are, the the computers, those software, those companies are using that information to determine what to show you next. And how soon to show it to you. They'll start showing you the same thing over and over again, even Google search, if you like, if you are a right, if you have a tendency to Google things that are conservative focused, and you always open those up, every time you go into Google to do a search for some information to quote, do your own research, the things that you already agree with are going to come up.

Cheryl Stuller 25:25

That's very true and very scary at the same time. My daughter was telling me about a friend of hers that was a conspiracy theorist, and this is an intelligent person. But they got wrapped up into what the media was saying, and these outliers and got focused in on that. And they didn't believe that Sandy Hook happened. Until Charlottesville happened. And this person actually lived there and saw that it actually happened, and then questioned. Well, I bet Sandy Hook happened too, how did I get down this rabbit hole? How did somebody that I view myself as intelligent get wrapped up in something that was so egregious, in thinking that it didn't happen? And disrespectful to the families that it did happen to, how did I get in that? And I think it's so easy because of that what you just said, about social media. Every time you click on something, it reinforces what you're clicking on. I think that's how this Qanon stuff is going on, and how relatives of mine and, and Brian's are believing this stuff. And you're going, how can you believe this stuff? And I think that's how.

Stasha Boyd 26:52

Well there's and there's, I wish I knew where was it, I'll see if I can find it and put it in the show notes. But there was this really good article a while back about how the Qanon phenomenon seems to follow IRL game theory and IRL means in real life game theory. So essentially, there are these games that people create, and in a way, kind of like, you know, Dungeons and Dragons or these games that you play, or basically, there's one person who sits at a computer, and they send out clues. And they say, you know, hey, this clue might be in this, you know, building and it might look like this, and you might, and they kind of go and try and find it. And they might be working in teams or whatever. But the way they work is they give people just enough information, that they're able to confirm their own belief. And then they get rewarded for it by finding the thing or they get frustrated by not finding it, and then redouble their efforts to go on. If you look at what the Qanon phenomenon did, it was the same thing. When it first started, it was more like, you know, it's like, well, um, here's, you know, here's something that we've heard, and everybody's talking about this, but don't believe me, go look for it yourself. But they've already pre planted the articles or the websites. And they were just sort of like little innocuous things that if you read it a certain way, they're like, Oh, that's suspicious. And then they put it in another little, what they call their drops, the Q drops, the Q drops would be some kind of really weirdly worded thing that if somebody went and researched it, and it really didn't matter what they paired it up with in their own mind. But you start making stronger and stronger connections, and you believe things that you come up with yourself a lot more than if somebody told you something. So this phenomenon started to occur. And I remember back when I first started these big seeing these big queues at the Trump rallies. And it was sort of like, what the hell is that? And started looking into it. And it's like, Okay, this is just some weird shit. And then when the guy went to the pizza place and shot the pizza place up. He did it because of that. And he's and here we've got. You're playing on the the I get, we talked last week about men, the good man, this man heard about children being attacked, and raped and all sorts of things in the basement of this pizza, pizza outfit. And he's like, somebody, nobody's doing anything. Somebody's got to do something. I've got to go. And so he even made a recording in his own car driving there to his own children saying, kids, I just want you to know if this doesn't go well. You know, Daddy loves you. And, you know, I did it for them. I did it be a good dad. So he's truly believing this.

Cheryl Stuller 29:27

I know.

Stasha Boyd 29:28

And now imagine that times millions.

Cheryl Stuller 29:33

Right? How did we get into a space where we are believing stuff like that? That's, I understand from what you just said, and and from talking to this other person, how it can happen. But I don't know how it can happen. Do you know what I mean? How do intelligent people that are educated and talk to other people, how do we go down those rabbit holes of accepting information like that? That is simply not true and very damaging.

Stasha Boyd 30:10

Um, I personally think it was a long, long road. I think that um, for me, I believe it started back in the the 80s primarily, so we're gonna stick with like the political side of it was the Newt Gingrich world, where it was like, it didn't matter what it was, as long as it was spun and politicized. And, you know, you could, hypocrisy and lies are just fine. And even before that, you go back into like the Nixon era. When you look at the dirty tricksters, and those dirty tricksters are still here with us. What's the one guy's name looks like the penguin? Roger Stone, I mean, these people, I mean, they're you trace this path back. And what happens is, I think, you know, politics has always been a source of like hidden information and some lies and some twisting and whatever. But I think it really became ingrained in certain parts of society and certain certain places. When we in our country started to break down that separation between our politics and our social morals which is what you got when you had the Moral Majority, and the Evangelical Church being out a lot of outreach to with the conservative side to get votes. And when that started, when people started like muddling both their morality and their religion, and their politics, or conversely, reacting very against that, and it, everything became such an incredibly high moral Hill to die on. It became worse and worse and worse. I mean, I know so many people who were willing to who did not like, you know, Donald Trump, but were willing to vote for him, because of the abortion issue. One thing, and I'm like, You're telling me that all of this other is okay. Because of this one, putting one person on the Supreme Court, you're okay with everything else, all the lies, all the sexual assault, all of the disrespect of the military, all of the demonization of a gold star family, all of that you can look, you can overlook all of that. Because he might be able to put somebody on the Supreme Court that you're more in tune to. And so I think that's exactly what, I think it's like when people started to be able to to this, honestly, the separation of church and state. It's like when we stopped, really trying harder to keep church and state separate is what I think the biggest problem was.

Cheryl Stuller 32:43

Well, and I think it's also back to that entitlement. Okay. It's like, um, well, I don't believe in abortion, well, then don't get an abortion. But don't take that right or opportunity away from somebody else, even if you don't agree with it. Why are you deciding and okay with deciding for somebody else, that that's how they should lead their life. And that's how they should feel about it. Gay marriage, if you don't believe in gay marriage, then don't marry a gay person. Okay, I just don't understand how it's okay to say, I don't believe in it, therefore, you should not be able to do it, I'm going to take that right away from you.

Stasha Boyd 33:25

I can, I can understand it. I disagree with it, but I understand it. So here's here's the understanding on the abortion issue. If you truly believe that a fertilized zygote is a human child is a human being, then nobody has a right to kill a human being especially not a defenseless child. If you truly believe that, then that's what it means. But if you're a person who does not believe that, you know, life begins at conception, if you believe that, you know, up until some point because again, everybody's making the argument about about abortion has to at some point grapple with that one question, at what point does this group of cells become a person? And that's the hard question. So the people who truly are truly deep in their heart anti abortion, then that's their belief. Now, my problem with that argument is that if that is your belief, and you truly it's about children, and it's about life, etc, etc, then you should also be on the front lines of every anti war demonstration where there's collateral damage of children, you should also be on the front lines of every I mean, you should have been burning down Flint with that whole water thing and the children that that took care of them there. You should have lost your mind over on Sandy Hook. Like but if you don't do that, then then then there's something wrong with your thought process between where does life start and where does it end and where does it not become important anymore?

Cheryl Stuller 34:53

And can I add to that and say then you should also be a foster parent who takes into your home, the kids that are sexually abused, that are not given food, that are beaten up at five years old. Because parents that had to have, that had kids should not have kids. And that's how that child is being raised. Then you also need to be okay with that.

Stasha Boyd 35:18

But I think that's when you go back down to the idea of like, where I think the problem starts. I think that that that is probably part of the problem. I can say, I understand your argument. I can, I can reiterate your argument back to you without making fun of it, without dismissing it, without saying it's a ridiculous argument. And I can still say I disagree with it. Most people that I know when it comes to any super controversial subject, whether it's gay marriage, or you know, abortion, or anything else, they can't sit there and look at the other person's side and articulate it back to them in a way that says, I understand your, your issue, I just disagree with your issue. And let me explain to you why.

Cheryl Stuller 35:59

However, I respect you as a person, and I don't want to take that right away from you, because you feel passionate about that. But this is how I feel. And I think that's where a lot of we are moving to as a society is we are not willing to see the other person's side, to hear the other person's story to have any kind of allowance for anything that somebody else might be going through. I think that's just quickly going away from us.

Stasha Boyd 36:30

Right. But that's the thing where I said, you know, when you look at where society like, you know, gains a new idea, and then it evolves into that idea. You know, gay marriage has quickly become an idea that a lot of people have evolved into. There is no, there are no grand rallies right now trying to stop, trying to overturn, you know, gay marriage in the US. They aren't there. There's, you know, other than a few like random churches here and there and a couple of bakers saying, I don't want to bake a cake or whatnot. Ain't nobody getting all excited about that issue. Mainly because the argument that that has been made, how does this affect you at all? If these two people over here get married? Is a better argument it has taken hold in the marketplace of ideas. And most people, the majority, a large majority of people now agree with it. Most people, and the ones who don't agree with it, are the ones who kind of get, you know, sat down and shut up a little bit. It's like, you know, yeah, yeah, well, whatever, okay, we're just, we're just gonna, like pretend like, you know, Uncle fester over here isn't talking, and we're all just going to move on.

Cheryl Stuller 37:33

And I know that this is a heavier issue morally for people. But I still, I still feel the same way about abortion, I still think that should be the litmus test for all of those social issues. Okay.

Stasha Boyd 37:47

But again, as to me, I still see the one with abortion as being a much more touchy issue, because you have to decide when that person becomes a person. And I think that's the main thing about that, is that that is a very hard one. And as long as, as long as we have, you know, you know, voting rights in the States, and everybody gets to vote, then it's all decided by vote in the States. And I think that, you know, given what Roe v Wade did was, it made a what it called considered a state issue, a national issue, because it didn't make the argument that a woman had a right to an abortion, I made the argument that a woman had a right to privacy. And that is the argument upon which Roe v Wade stands, is that it's a private decision, and that the government has no right to intrude upon that decision, or any enforcement of it. And then it took that and applied it to all the states because that's the overarching Federal Interest was in the right to privacy. Um, so the the argument about how it comes and goes is is a complex argument. And for me, there are still plenty of people on both sides of that argument, who can make very good arguments back and forth. Now, for me, I always tell people, you know, my support of abortion rights is pretty tenuous, you know, I would absolutely be willing to outlaw it the day after, the day after you guarantee that the child is not the one to suffer from the decision. That means that the mother has to have childcare, that the mother has to have medical care, that the mother has to have income and opportunity. That means there has to be stability, that means that there has to be educational opportunities, that all of the things that have to happen to make sure that that child is able to grow up and to be a fully functioning adult. And you're also making it where you're changing society so that, you know, young women having sex is not seen as the horrible thing. It's not, pregnancy is not punishment for a woman having sex, you'd have to change that there is a that that single motherhood is is not a taboo, again, that's society saying this is what you need to do. You'd have to completely change society. Contraception would be free, available and absolute. Not just available, but encouraged. If you didn't use it, people would be like, Oh my God, why not? That's weird, you'd have to have that kind of a societal change. If you did all of those things, I'd be like, Okay, then in that case, there's really not much of an excuse anymore for an unintended pregnancy. So, Alright, let it go. But I don't think any of those other things are going to happen. So, at least not enough of them to make that work. So therefore, I do believe that a woman needs to have the right to choose. But part of that is because that question of when does life begin? When does it, when do we have, when does it become a point where this this entity has become an individual? For me, that bar does not start at conception. And I can admit that, but for a person who truly believes it, does, they can't admit that.

Cheryl Stuller 40:49

Right. Well, I know it's a complex issue. But I just feel like at the basis of everything, we should still be willing to listen to the other side and respect the other side and not take rights away.

Stasha Boyd 41:07

Well, and I think that's, it goes back to that whole question about, you know, what, how does society look at things? And that's really the bigger slide. And actually, this is like, going in a complete direction, I had no intention to go in with this conversation.

Cheryl Stuller 41:19

But these are, these are hot buttons, societal issues that divide us.

Stasha Boyd 41:25

Yeah, but I think it's because I see societies are so so different within a community. So for example, you know, in my society here, where I live, you know, it's a, it's a hop on your golf cart and ride downtown and have drinks and dinner kind of society. You know, most of the people that I know, in my circle, they don't, they're not church goers. They, a lot of they, most of them have businesses, most of the people in my society for the most part, except for politically, now, we pretty much do the same thing, look the same, dress the same, act the same, enjoy the same activities. For the most part, we're, we're a pretty, you know, cohesive unit. However, you take any one of us, send us, you know, a mile and a half, south and east, and we'd be in a whole different culture, in our community, the African American culture here, they have, they go to their own clubs, they have their own churches, they go, they you don't, don't see a lot of our local African American people in our restaurants, some are there, certainly, we have a certain amount of diversity, but a lot of those folks travel, there's an entirely different society that exists a mile and a half from my house. And that's fine. I mean, you can have different societies within one geographic region. As long as you're not fighting each other.

Cheryl Stuller 42:37

Right.

Stasha Boyd 42:38

You can have different you know, as a as they share the same values of healthy homes and enjoyable lives and financial prosperity and all of these kinds of things. If those are shared values, then you're can have communities, their societies coexist. If they're not sharing those basic values, if we can't agree on those things, then that's when you start getting like the super rich. And that's where I think, you know, you look at places where, where black lives matter, really stands up and stands out. It's because these societies are going like no, apparently, we don't agree on something so basic as the right to be able to walk down the street and not get shot. Apparently, we don't agree on that.

Cheryl Stuller 43:21

The realtor that was showing his client a home-

Stasha Boyd 43:27

And the client's 15-year-old son.

Cheryl Stuller 43:29

And got arrested for doing that. I, it's just crazy to me. I don't. Those are the things that I don't understand how those things are allowed to happen. You know, and they're heartbreaking stories.

Stasha Boyd 43:44

Yeah. And I think that they are right now, it's like they're allowed, they're allowed to happen, because there isn't enough will and common ground in the leadership structures of various entities and institutions to change them yet. I do think those are going to change. I really do. Because I think as the I think that the the motives or the motivation is strong. I think that the arguments are that there are good arguments, even though they are not being articulated right now. I think there are good arguments, I think one of the ones that I feel like people miss all the time. It's like if you look at a picture of the House of Representatives, for example, and you look at a picture of the Democratic representatives and you look at a picture of the Republican representatives. The democratic representatives, lots you know two genders, multiple, inter- multiple races, international etc. group of people. You look at the Republican side of it, basically the dominated by white men, and with a handful of white women. I don't think there are any African American women on the Republican side. There's only a couple of African American men. And for me, what that says is that you know, what does an American look like? Until society can look from like a person like me, can look at my face, and then look at a dark skinned African American woman's face, or look at a very round, Asian American or Pacific Islander person's face and say all three of those with equal sincerity looks like an American. That's the argument that I think is not being made. It's like, what does an American look like, right now you have a group of people who are saying Americans only look like me. And that, I think, is an argument that's going to have to fall, because pretty soon we are going to be a minority majority country. And it's not gonna keep holding.

Cheryl Stuller 45:47

Brian and I went to Atlanta to pick something up. And while we were waiting to to leave, we went to a town close, like outside of Atlanta. And everyone, everyone in this area was black. And we were literally the only two white people. And we were treated so kindly. And we were talked to, we weren't ignored. We weren't looked at as if we were suspicious, we didn't have to worry about how we were dressed, we could go into any store that we wanted to. Um, but I also got the sense of what somebody else might be going through on the other side that I had never been through before. I've never been the only white person in a town. This was literally a town. Um, and and I said, What a thing to go through number one, I'm glad that I had that experience. And I'm glad that I wasn't treated or my husband wasn't treated like somebody else might have been treated had the had that been reversed, you know.

Stasha Boyd 47:11

But in a way, that's also the definition of white privilege. Now people say, like, well, I don't even know what white privilege is and I'm like, well, honey, it's getting to be 55 years old and never having experienced that.

Cheryl Stuller 47:21

Exactly. And that's the that's the very conversation that I had with my daughter. I said, How is that a thing? That that's never been a thing? Right?

Stasha Boyd 47:33

But here, yeah, but here's how it, here's how it's the thing. The towns that we live in, the downtown's, the, the commercial areas, or whatever. Basically, those spaces are, quote, unquote, predominantly white spaces. Now, again, I can go a few blocks away. And there is an area of town that has businesses and restaurants and different things that are predominately black spaces. We don't go, now that's not true. We do go when they had, there was a great barbecue place over there. And then I will say it's not a lot, I don't want to make it sound like it's like downtown, downtown in our little town. It's not it's like a few shops and stores. Um, but it's because we don't go. And the reason we don't go is because the way I was raised, being a child of the deep south, was that you just don't do that. You don't go to quote unquote, bad parts of town, you don't go to the back in my day, when it was when we were kids. Unfortunately, we kind of, well, no, we didn't really, like people were still using the N word completely indiscriminately. But you know, in polite society, they'd say, you know, when you don't go to the colored side of town, you just don't do that. So those things become, and again, once you're taught that, as a child, that just becomes kind of ingrained. That's just kind of how you live your life as you grow up and grow older. And I think most people have that in one way. The opposite side of it, and we've done a lot of work for African American history museums and African American cultural centers. And I remember sitting down with this one woman, and she was talking about how, you know, one of the things about and she was, uh, she grew up under the Jim Crow laws. And she said, one of the things that you don't realize is like, you know, that we didn't realize under Jim Crow was that yes, we were being kept in this, you know, very tiny area. But doctors lived next to shopkeepers who lived next to lawyers who lived next to, you know, plumbers, etc. You had this range of view. She's like, but you never you knew that you didn't you knew you did where you didn't belong. You knew where you weren't supposed to go. On the other side of that line, folks knew where they weren't supposed to go. So you never had in the case of this woman's life and the way she explained it, she's like, you know, as she grew up her, she felt like that, her family that she felt bad in a lot of ways for a lot of the folks on the other side of town, because she said even though they were keeping me out, I felt like they were keeping out so much of my goodness, so much of the wonderfulness about me. I remember thinking at the time in that conversation, I'm like, that's mighty magnanimous, that's mighty big of you, that's a mighty big way of thinking about it. I didn't have the presence of mind to ask her if that's what she thought at the time, or if that's what she thought later in life upon reflection. For me, a lot of things that I thought at the time were just, you know, thoughts any other girl raised in the 70s in the South would think it's like, you know, no, we're not going to that side of town. That's crazy. Why would you do that? And now as a, as a person who's 50, I pretty much go where I want. Um, I don't have a I don't have a, I do still maintain a sense of danger around poverty. And that, I've been to some pretty dangerous places. But I think that I try to maintain a consciousness of things to the best of my ability without trying to change the entire world every time I need to run down to Publix.

Cheryl Stuller 51:13

Yeah, I think one of the things that my parents did really well was to teach me: judge the person on their character and how they treat other people how they treat their family members, how they treat society as a whole. Judge them on that, because I will tell you that I have been through my guardian ad litem stuff. And even before that, when I was working with Mainstay the domestic violence shelter. I have been in some horrible situations, safety wise, how people were living and how they treated you. And I can tell you that I have, my experience has been more white people have been more rude and have treated their children badly and you know, have allowed things to happen to their children than any other race. So I would say judge the person on their character and not any other way.

Stasha Boyd 52:27

Well, I and I agree with that. I think the question is, though, it's like you know, we also have a tendency sometimes to look back upon our own history with some some rose colored glasses. But considering where we were when we grew up, when you were in middle school, what would have happened or early in high school? What do you think would have happened? Had you decided to come home and dated a black man or black boy?

Cheryl Stuller 52:50

Well, considering how they felt about my first husband, it might have been a good thing.

Stasha Boyd 52:59

I can tell you right now, cuz I know what church they went to. And I know what was preached from that pulpit and I can tell you right now, what they would have, how they would have reacted.

Cheryl Stuller 53:08

Yeah, I wish I could challenge that and ask that question. I just, it just never came up. Because although I had a lot of black friends in high school, as did you, too, um, and we even hung out. We even hung out before. I never, I never dated. I only dated one person. My parents didn't like him. So I don't I don't have a wide range of, you know, dating experience to go by to test that theory.

Stasha Boyd 53:43

But even even in friends I mean, like I said, You know, I had friends at school that were school friends that they were from, you know, the black community and our where we lived, but I never once had any of the anybody who's black over for a sleep over.

Cheryl Stuller 53:55

I didn't have anybody ever for a sleep over. Yeah. I did have black friends come over. I have had that before. I not to sleep over. And, you know, there was a trailer park in where we grew up, that I would frequent quite often that I got in trouble for too.

Stasha Boyd 54:19

Was it the one that was up there close to the close to the church?

Cheryl Stuller 54:22

Yes, yeah. Yes.

Stasha Boyd 54:24

But there weren't a lot but there weren't a lot of black families in that that trailer park. That was that was mostly white families in that trailer park.

Cheryl Stuller 54:30

Hmm. And I would say that, um, I got into a lot of trouble with some of those white families in that trailer park.

Stasha Boyd 54:39

Right. Going back to the thing about you know, understanding where where we grew up. So many people want to make it sound like it was something other than what it was. It wasn't. It was every bit as just casually racist as every single other portion of the deep south. Our churches were. Our the schools were. It's like you can go into any cafeteria, it's like, you know, you'd have all the white kids sitting at their tables, all the black kids sitting at their tables. Go out, you know, in our high school. Remember there was like the, the the Redneck kids hung out on the that the the split rail fence between the two buildings, and they would spit on the sidewalk that was just so disgusting. And then the African American kids, they all hung out in this one hallway, that's where they would stay. And that's where most of them would try to get their lockers assigned. Then there was like the kind of average nerdy kids, they were the ones over there by Mrs. Yuno's class and like some of these others, that was their hallway. It's like there was always this kind of like pulling apart of that. And so each one of those was their own society that had its own rules of what was and wasn't okay. And if somebody in their group started expressing opinions and views that were outside of what that society thought was okay, you would get ostracized, you would get made fun of, you would get notes passed around behind you, you would get called names. Some people would have gotten in fights. You know, there is no way that in the high school we grew up with that there would have been a redneck boy and an African American girl out there on that split rail fence and everybody and would not have had people looking at them going, Oh, my God, this is not happening. Teachers would have been out there, parents would have been out there.

Cheryl Stuller 56:23

Yeah, I guess I didn't even view it that way. Because to me, it wasn't a big deal. I would hang out with people because you and I were in band. You know, we had friends of all ethnicities, how do you say it as ethnicities, and it wasn't a big deal for us. So it I guess it wasn't on my radar. But now that you're saying it, and I'm looking back, I totally agree with you. But I I know, I didn't think at the time, oh, I'm not allowed to hang out with this person or this person, or this person. Only if they did drugs or if you know, that was the kid that drove me home and he was drunk. You know, that was more the conversation in my house.

Stasha Boyd 57:10

But and that's going back to the thing about that what I mean about society being this invisible thing, it's just this this it's like the air you breathe. You didn't see it. Because to you it wasn't there. It was this is just how it is, isn't it? Just everything's fine. Of course, it's fine. You know, everything's okay. But somebody else in that same group may have been looking around going like, yeah, this isn't okay.

Cheryl Stuller 57:31

You're absolutely right.

Stasha Boyd 57:34

And like, for example, I got, you know, about band, you know, in summer when we'd have band camp. When we got to the point where we could drive, I had, remember I had the little white pickup. And, you know, after when we had our breaks, we jumped in the truck, people would jump in the back, and we'd go tearing down to the to the convenience store about a mile away. And to go in to get our cokes and our RC's and our moon pies and our whatever else we're going to get. However, the sign on the door, in that particular particular convenience store said no, P I C K E R S. P as in Paul, I C K pickers, they were talking about fruit pickers or citrus pickers. No pickers allowed. Now here's the thing. There were no white pickers at that point. Everybody, everybody knew that that sign meant that black kids could not come in. Everybody knew that. So you know, we would say, Well, what do y'all want? You know, and we would just go get it and bring it back again. We thought nothing. I thought nothing of it. Like, okay, you know, well, I get it, you know, it took me until joining Up With People to realize that that was wrong. Realize what was really happening there. I didn't know. And even then, what would I have done about it? Would I have gone in there, you know, and just get raised hell, this isn't any fair or whatever? Probably not. Because remember, I was the good kid. I wasn't a rabble rouser. So that's how I think a lot of times when we talk about society now I'm kind of coming back around to you know, what, what is society for and man, we have really gone off on a track here. I was thinking more about, you know, what the the effect that um, you know, society has on women, basically, how it tells us, especially middle aged women and women who are getting older, that for the longest time, you know, when you get older, you just disappear. You don't get service that at restaurants, people, like don't give you any service. You go into buy clothes in a store and you get ignored. All of these things kind of start happening. Um, and that's a societal thing that I think is kind of changing now. It's slowly changing, but there are still a lot of people that you know, see what I mean. Let a woman be overweight and a little wrinkly. And let me tell you what kind of you know shit she'll get if she posts a picture of herself on Facebook. And everybody thinks that's just fine. Or the people who think it's not fine are more like it's like those people being jerks not there's nothing wrong with the way that woman looks, because they think there is something wrong with the way that woman looks. And they don't notice it. Because of the same reason. You didn't notice the general atmosphere when we were kids. It's just there.

Cheryl Stuller 1:00:19

Yeah, I didn't really, I had an uncle who would say the N word. And I, you know, I said something to him one day, and I and I said, I know that I'm in your house. So just know that I know that. I said, but I really don't like that you are saying that, especially when the very people that you're talking about help you bring in the crops every single day of every single year.

Stasha Boyd 1:00:46

Right. How old were you when you had that conversation.

Cheryl Stuller 1:00:52

I was probably 35. So I was well into my adult years. They didn't say that around me when I was younger. This was a conversation that happened as we were sitting around the table as adults. You know, we didn't, I didn't hear that. I didn't hear that word. I didn't hear that disrespect happen as a kid.

Stasha Boyd 1:01:17

Then you did not spend much time at Granddaddy's house because that was the common way of talking. In his case, though. He literally, he literally meant nothing by it. Now people always said, Of course he did. I'm like, well, Yes, he did. He did, because that was who he was. But for him. He would say it in a positive way. And in a negative way. I mean, it's just, and then when you're, again, when you're a kid, and you don't know any difference, and no any better, you don't understand the difference. You don't understand why, what the challenges that is, and you will not understand unless you get out of that environment. And you hear somebody else say, no, that's not okay. And then you say, Well, how dare you talk about my Granddaddy like that, and you've got to get past you're mad, and you're afront of somebody trying to tell you something, and then you've got to be able to look at it from another person's point of view. And I think, you know, we talked about that bigger picture about society. I think that what we're getting into is that idea of what is and isn't Okay, going back to and we're kind of running out of time. So we're going to wrap this one up. But what we're getting away from and what I think we're backsliding into, is there was a time when you know, a person, a big politician standing up and calling somebody else a name on both sides of the aisle will be that is uncalled for. They would have shouted that down the constituents would have been like that's beneath the dignity of the office. What's happening now is there are not, people aren't calling that down. Other leaders are not saying that's not right. I'm not you're not going to be welcomed back at the table until you change your ways. That's what's not happening.

Cheryl Stuller 1:02:26

There's no decency and respect, I agree.

Stasha Boyd 1:02:56

There's no accountability for indecency and disrespect so but I gotta tell you, we really went off on a wild tangent here. This was not my intension, I was I was planning to talk about fun and funny stuff. Look at Cheryl bringing out the heavy

Cheryl Stuller 1:03:10

Did I not tell you this would be that episode. I knew. I knew it would be that.

Stasha Boyd 1:03:15

Why did I write all these notes?

Cheryl Stuller 1:03:17

It's an important conversation to have though, so.

Stasha Boyd 1:03:20

It is, it is an important conversation. So let's let's end up with like, what's our main point? Our always wrap up question. If people listen to this incredible conversation, and they take one thing away from it, what's the what's the point? What's, what's your point about society that you see now? What would you want people to take away from it?

Cheryl Stuller 1:03:37

Quit being entitled, be willing to listen to other people and their viewpoint. And as they say, walk a mile in another man's shoes, and really be open to listening. And then if you still don't agree, I still love and respect you. I'm just going to disagree with you on that subject. And let that be the end of it. It doesn't have to be a fight or an argument or I'm going to cut you off as a friend or a family member. I just think we need to be more open and respectful of everyone. Until if you're a person who doesn't earn the respect based on how what your character is and how you treat other people. I'm going to cut you off for that. Absolutely. If you're not a good person, then I don't care what you think. You're out of my life anyway,

Stasha Boyd 1:04:32

I and I would say that that's similar to what yours is. For me the point is, is that, you know, in order to be to be able to recognize society, to recognize what these pressures are, that you feel, and that you're feeling that, that if you, that if something's kind of kind of pressing it on you or if you're afraid to say something, if you don't want to talk about something, that's the society you're in, you are internalizing it and you're understanding that pressure. If you feel like you can't talk, you're in a society that is pressuring you to do something or to not do something, and to be able to take a step back and see what it is. Because most of us just kind of wander through this, this world as if you know everything, the way, the way you we see things is the way things really are and ought to be. But it's like, no, not everything. Not everything that you see and that that works out for you right now is good for everyone. Not every society is moving in a good direction. Not every society's rules need to be followed, some of them need to be changed, and some of them need to be discarded. But you can't do that until you can see it. So that's, that's my number one takeaway, and my number two, kind of in a way is similar to what you were saying, but kind of on a separate tack, is that for me, it's not. I firmly believe that respect is something that you give, and not necessarily something that you can expect. So you know, I give respect to people, even if I'm like, if I disagree with them and if they're saying that I don't like or something like that. I can show respect to somebody by not bad mouthing them, by not calling them stupid, things of that nature. I will draw the line when what happens, when they start coming back at me, or people that I know and that I love, like at that point. Okay, you have you're behaving disrespectfully. You have earned my disrespect. And I don't have to be nice to you anymore.

Cheryl Stuller 1:06:18

Exactly.

Stasha Boyd 1:06:20

Yeah, and that's and that's my line. It's like, you know, are you being rude? Are you being rude to me? Are you being rude to somebody that I know and love? That's the that's the the extent of it. So so that's what I have. And I'm now out of my little mocktail. I've drank all of mine. And it is hotter than hell on here. So we're gonna have to wrap this up cuz I am hot.

Cheryl Stuller 1:06:40

Wrap it up. What are we talking about next?

Stasha Boyd 1:06:43

Next week, girl, we got goals. Goals are coming up. Yeah. I don't know what about goals. I mean, it's probably gonna be about, I think it's about setting goals, is it about obtaining goals, is it about worthy goals and unworthy goals, is it about I don't know. So what I think it's gonna be something around you know, the idea of, of setting your sights on something and going about it together.

Cheryl Stuller 1:07:07

We'll have to we'll have to think on that one.

Stasha Boyd 1:07:09

Yeah. Alrighty, then. Well, I'm going to sign us off then. Everybody once again, always. Thank you all for joining us. Thank y'all. If y'all stayed with this one to the end, man. God bless you.

Cheryl Stuller 1:07:24

Bye.