Values: We never go against who we really are

Lots of folks claim lots of things about their values…while the rest of us sit over here with popcorn and see how the act. (We’re looking at you, pearl-clutching Family Values chick; and you too, Mr. Personal Responsibility dude.) But other people, often women in midlife, choose to take time and take stock; to re-examine and re-discover; and shape who they want to be in their next chapter. 

In this episode, Values, Stasha shares a full-proof way to check yourself, and identify, without a doubt, what your values REALLY are. Meanwhile, Cheryl gets real about what happens when your values don’t line up with people you know and love. 

So, grab a tall drink, take a deep breath, and get ready to go deep down on our deep-down selves. 


Stasha’s mocktail: Berry/Kambucha Fizz
 
(I’m still on my alcohol-free August so this is a mocktail I made up just for me. I’m trying out Kambucha and finding it quite tasty.)

•  2-3 strawberries
• 3-4 raspberries
• 5-8 mint leaves
• Kambucha (flavor of your choice, I used a berry flavored from Publix organics)
• Fruit flavored sparkling water (I used La Croix Peach/Pear because that’s what I had on hand)
• Lime wedge

 Muddle the berries in a glass or bowl the press through a strainer into a glass. Add ice. Add ¼ - ½ C kambucha and then fill remaining glass with flavored sparkling water. Garnish with lime wedge if you like it a little more tart.

 Cheryl had a hell of a few weeks, so she's sticking with that old southern favorite, iced tea. 

Transcript

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 Stasha Boyd  00:01

Hi there, I'm Stasha.

Cheryl Stuller  00:03

I'm Cheryl. 

Stasha Boyd  00:05

And between us we have 

Cheryl Stuller  00:06

four kids, 

Stasha Boyd  00:07

three businesses, 

Cheryl Stuller  00:08

two husbands and one goal:

Stasha Boyd  00:10

To get to The Point of the Matter. And the way people can really identify a value, and the way I would teach it was, you know, when you, when something insults, somebody can insult, you know, an interest of yours and you can laugh it off. Somebody can like say something contrary to something that you're good at or a skill and you might get a little annoyed or irked, but you know, you're not going to go flying off the handle. But if something insults your values, your number one reaction is anger.

Cheryl Stuller  00:43

If you want those deep and meaningful relationships, then your values have to either align or coexist. So it's really important to figure that out with whoever you have in your inner circle. 

Stasha Boyd  00:59

Hello, Cheryl. 

Cheryl Stuller  01:00

Hello, Stasha. 

Stasha Boyd  01:03

How's your week? How's it going? We're back again. 

Cheryl Stuller  01:07

We're back again. We took a little break and we're back. So something funny that happened this weekend. Funny phrase that I think was hilarious, and it just kind of lightened the weekend. Kyle looked out onto the deck and said it's the goddamn squirrels fault. Well, all of these things were raining down, you know, walnuts and debris and he looked out and he's like, what's going on? And he goes Oh! It's the goddamn squirrel's fault. So we're getting a bunch of stuff falling out of the trees from the squirrels up there.

Stasha Boyd  01:47

And that's why you need that neighborhood cat you know, to kind of be on patrol so that the squirrels know that that area is you know, capital.

Cheryl Stuller  01:55

I just saw him today he was over there. So apparently he's not doing his job.

Stasha Boyd  01:59

Man. And that's what I tell all the animals around here I'm like look, you can stay but you got to work. You know, nobody gets to sit around here for free. I need stuff done. Cat I need you to keep the birds out of out of the garden and the squirrels out from eating the flowers. Snakes if you're out there, you guys will be taking care of little rodents. That's your job. You know, get on it. kittens here in the house. Your job is to like you know, give Mommy lovins and to be cute. Not tear things up. Everybody's got a job.  But so how so the week so you got to... 

Cheryl Stuller  02:02

How was your week? 

Stasha Boyd  02:33

Well, my week is, well for starters, the AC is still out in the office. So I'm in the house today. So for you guys listening, um, I do not have my nice setup. So I'm hoping that my recording sounds okay. Um, if it doesn't, please just bear with us on this one. But otherwise, the week was pretty pretty standard. We, um, we did a, no AC so what wasn't working up in the office. First technical issues. Everybody knows how much I hate those. But the other thing we did go up to Momma and Daddy's for work day to do some projects up there that you know my Dad can use some help with. And I will tell you this, because this is actually funny. So one of the projects coming up quickly, is they want to replace both of the toilets in their bed in their bathrooms. they've got separate bathrooms, one for each of them. And I was talking to my cousin Sammy and because because mama couldn't find what she wanted. And you know that she wanted a certain color, she wanted a certain height, all sorts of things. But I'm like Sammy I know they're not making them like that anymore. You know, you just get white and you can get tall or short. And that's pretty much it. I know she's going to go shopping on these fancy places. But you know, my mother is not going to go out there and spend $2,000 on you know, a couple of toilets. I was wrong. I was a lot wrong. So these toilets, A: for the both of them are a lot more than $2,000 for starters. And they are and it has this like and it's really thinking ahead. It's very good for older people, but it has like one of the day seat things on it. But that has like the water that shoots up and they've got one that's got warm water, it has a remote control, it has a nightlight. I mean this is, it's like an E ticket ride. I told, I don't Sammy like anybody that comes over, we'll like charge money to go use the bathroom.

Cheryl Stuller  04:16

Oh my gosh, everybody's gonna be hanging out in the bathroom now.

Stasha Boyd  04:20

Yeah, well, you know, at least it will be nice and clean and fresh. And real real quick I'd like to let everybody know we're still on our Cheryl and I are both still on our kind of alcohol free kick right now. I'm doing alcohol free August. So I have a little mocktail here of my own creation. I'm trying some kombucha. So I did a berry blend kombucha with some sparkling water and some fresh raspberries and strawberries all muddled together with some mint and it's really tasty so it'd probably also be good if somebody wanted to put like a shot of vodka or something like that in it. Really nice flavorful beverage but that's mine. 

Cheryl Stuller  04:56

That looks yummy. 

Stasha Boyd  04:58

It really is.

Cheryl Stuller  04:59

I'm sticking with my lemon tea. 

Stasha Boyd  05:04

So what are we talking about today, Cheryl. 

Cheryl Stuller  05:06

We're talking about values today. And I think this is such an important subject, especially for what I'm going through right now. And we're going to talk about how you maneuver through somebody that you're close to that has different values than you, how do you navigate that? So values are a person's principles or standard of behavior, and fundamental beliefs that guide or motivate attitudes and actions. So that's kind of what we're going to be talking about today. And some core values are honesty, kindness, compassion, respect, and I love this one, personal responsibility. What do you think of that?

Stasha Boyd  05:53

Um, I agree, and I think that those are, that's a list of values. But I think that, um, there are a lot of people have values that aren't on that list. And they want to say, Oh, my, I have my values are compassion, my values are kindness, you know, and what their value really is, is money or power. They, that's really what they value. And if they're honest with themselves, they really take an honest look, you know, part of their, the challenges that they have is because they keep telling themselves, they have one set of values, and they keep operating in a completely different way.

Cheryl Stuller  06:24

And that's how you get told out is, you can say whatever you want to say, but it's gonna come out on on the other side as to how you treat people.

Stasha Boyd  06:36

Yeah, that's, and I think that is pretty true. Because one of the things about values, and for the folks who didn't know, one of the things that I have done in my past is I worked, I was an adjunct instructor at a local community college for, I taught my, I have a master's degree in human resources, and I'm in a creative field. So I taught career development for creative fields. And one of the things that I developed my program, of course this is back when you were allowed to develop your own program, but I developed a program and part of what I taught the students and worked on, is really understanding what your values are. Because if you're gonna be happy in your work life, you want something where your your values, your interests, and your skills all intersect. And you know right, right in the middle of that little diagram is where you find you know, your ideal job, or ideal career or something. But I always started with values. And a lot of times when I would talk to students about this, they mostly, I would say, I don't even know if this is most people. So a lot of people, they walk through their life completely unexamined. And they have no idea what their values really are.

Cheryl Stuller  07:41

Mm hmm. Why do you think that is?

Stasha Boyd  07:44

I think it's because we don't we don't ask ourselves to reflect enough. You know, we don't that's not part of our culture and society, a lot of self reflection, a lot of questioning of you know, well, what do I really believe? How do I really act? So I think that part of it is that we have a tendency as a wider culture, to one, just kind of wander through life. And also two, I think we do get caught up in that list you just ran down. People kind of hear the list and go Okay, well, that's it. Well, I'm gonna pick compassion and what were some of the others on it unfortunately I don't have my notes up.

Cheryl Stuller  08:23

Kindness

Stasha Boyd  08:23

Kindness, so yeah, I'm all about compassion and kindness, those are my two values. And then you know, let me tell you something every time push comes to shove, bitch isn't compassionate, and she ain't kind neither. But what she might be, is always acts, kind of acts in accordance with a person who's seeking power. So what her real value is, what she really values is power.

Cheryl Stuller  08:47

Well, and I think sometimes, you know, as how I behaved with the girl who took my parking spot, sometimes you don't act appropriately, when you do have those values. And you have to say, Wow, really sorry about that. I didn't treat you with kindness, or I didn't treat you with respect. And that's not, and that's not how I want you to feel and that's not how I want to treat you. So my bad and I'm going to try to do better.

Stasha Boyd  09:17

And I would make the argument that the reason that upsets you so much is because that did insult your values somehow. There's like maybe one of your values is fairness, maybe one of your values, your deep value is respect. And the way people can really identify a value and the way I would teach it was, you know, when you when something insults, somebody to insult you know, an interest of yours and you can laugh it off. Somebody can like say something contrary to something that you're good at or a skill and you might get a little annoyed or irked, but you know you're not going to go flying off the handle. But if something insults your values, your number one reaction is anger. Always. And it will it will And for some people it's enraging. And for an emotionally mature person, they can recognize that and they don't let themselves get carried away with anger or rage. Other people, though, who just kind of like live on this kind of open ended idea of whatever I say goes, they what's happening is that they're actually acting on a value that they have not acknowledged themselves or that they're not aware of.

Cheryl Stuller  10:26

Okay, well, what would that value be? If you're acting out on anger?

Stasha Boyd  10:32

Well, because an emotion is like a barometer, it's not it's not a value of itself. So being angry is not a value, being happy is a value. But if so, but it's a reaction to something. So let's say you know, you're blithely going along in life. So here, here's one for me. So one of my, and I, I have one of my number one values is independence, right? You know, if you if you really want to just see me get enraged, tell me I can't do something. Tell me you have authority over me. Try and tell me that what you say is going to go because you say so? I'm like, No, no, I don't, I don't think so. Now, if I am in a situation, let's say where I used to be at work, when I used to have a job job. And a supervisor, whatever would say to me, like, Oh, no, Stasha you're going to do this this way. Because I said so. You're going to do this this way because here's a supervisor giving you a note, or, you know, heaven forbid, somebody try and like do an evaluation of me and get it do it poorly. I'm like, No, no, you are. That's, that threatens my independence. My reaction is anger. If you want me to do something, you should, you have to convince me why I why it's in my best interest to do so or why it is the best thing to do. And if you can't do that, I may or may not do it anyway. But I won't keep doing it for long.

Cheryl Stuller  11:56

And that's why you and I don't work for other people. 

Stasha Boyd  12:02

No, I am not a good employee. No, oh my god, I'm a good employee. I'm just not an easy employee. 

Cheryl Stuller  12:09

Well, and last week, I have two girls that work in the office. And last week, one of the girls was out on vacation, and the main one, and so um, the other girl was having a really hard week. So I was taking phone call. I was in the office a lot more last week, and I was taking phone calls and everything. And I got about through half the day. And I was like, I don't know how you do this all day. I am so amped up and frustrated. And I cannot understand how people have to deal with people like this all the time and go home and are in a good mood, like I was, I was ugh, it was awful. 

Stasha Boyd  12:51

Well what were these people doing that was, that was making you angry, that was angering. That was infuriating. 

Cheryl Stuller  12:56

The main thing is everybody wants what they want when they want it. And I had I was telling this one lady, I said, I cannot put you ahead of other people. We're already scheduled out a month, you're gonna have to wait all month. And that's the way it is. Oh but, Bla bla bla bla bla, I'm like, No, I'm sorry, and I had to tell her, I'm not going to argue about this anymore. I told you I'm not gonna put you ahead of other people. That's the end of the conversation. If you go with us, I'm sorry, you're gonna have to wait. You're in a queue, you know? And if you don't want to wait, please go with somebody else. I'm fine with that as well. Let me know what you decide. 

Stasha Boyd  13:43

So give me an example of one of the others. 

Cheryl Stuller  13:47

Um, it's the whole I want it right now. Well, I can't give you that right now. But my generator's not working. I understand that. But I can have somebody out there tomorrow. We have a guy out today. You know, it's just that whole conversation around, you know, you can't have it a lot of times when you want it. Because we're booked out, you know, and just people don't understand that and they don't care and they don't listen, and they want it their way and that's the only way they want it.

Stasha Boyd  14:20

Is this kind of a thing that comes up with you a lot? Things that like, you know, send you thermonuclear is people operating with a sense of entitlement, you know, that you need to do it because they said so well, they got a need and well, and you're trying to get them to understand that other people's needs are out there. So if I was going to venture a guess as to what kind of you know, value that that is affronting? I would say it's either something like you know, you have a value of fairness or you have a value of reasonableness or one of your top values is cooperation or something of that nature. Um, because it's not like you know, it's not punitive. It's not like somebody calls up on the phone and you're like, he he he, This person's gonna wait two weeks for no reason. Or if you couldn't make an adjustment for somebody who was, if somebody called up and said, I have my grandmother is on oxygen and we are out of heating or we've got this? Is there anything you can do for me? I will do anything.

Cheryl Stuller  15:16

Yes. And we would have taken care of that person had that, had it been a medical issue. Yeah. And I made sure of that, there were no medical issues. This was just my generator's not working. I need it to be working right now. And I said, I'm sorry, I can't accommodate you, and the person had power. And that's another thing. It's not like the person didn't have power, they still have power. But it didn't come on for its exercise time. And then he got a fault notification. You know, and so we do absolutely do emergency work. And we go out immediately if somebody is without power, it's a medical issue. But this was not that situation.

Stasha Boyd  15:59

Yeah. And and here's like, one of the differences. And so even though I have a I really I like people who are reasonable, I like people who have that kind of thing. If that if I'm dealing with that person, I don't have an anger reaction. I have a pretty I actually have either a, it's like funny to me, I'll be like, it's like, Can you believe this person? Oh, my God, what? What is up? Or I will just kind of, you know, go, and and next week? No, we can't do that. Nope, not gonna happen. Nope, not going to. And it's just so I don't feel anger at it. Whereas if somebody was saying to me on that same call, well, here's what you're going to do, you're going to do this, and you're going to do this, and you're gonna do this, and you're going to do it because of blah, blah, blah, I would be like, Oh, no, no, not, not a chance. And that would have been anger. Another one of the things I found that I've had a significant value for me. And again, sometimes I don't, I don't have a word right at the tip of my tongue anymore. But, um, bullying. Anything that I consider bullying, a more powerful person picking on a less powerful person, an adult picking on a child or striking a child or abusing a child, a person who, um, who is using their, either their authority, or their presence or anything like that to do either on purpose, or even inadvertently harm a person that does not have that same sense of power. That that sends me into a thermonuclear rage. And I will And usually, like once I recognize that I know, that's what the problem is, and I'm pretty good at quickly calming myself back down. But I will absolutely intervene in any situation like that, because I true. And, because that brings up another point, if you go against your values, if something forces you some way to go against your values, you will you will be psychologically you will, it will damage you, you will feel psychological damage. And that's actually one of the things that happens with soldiers who, combat soldiers a lot of times who find themselves in situations where they're where they're doing things or have done things, or witnessed things that are so contrary to who they are as a person and who they tell they are tell themselves they are as a person and their deepest values. But that's part of PTSD.

Cheryl Stuller  18:20

Absolutely part of it. Absolutely. Which leads us into our next discussion points. And I really like this little example. So a person who values honesty might blow the whistle on a financial wrongdoing by a superior while another person values loyalty and would remain silent. That creates a values conflict. I just love that example. Because it also brings to mind that piece of compassion and empathy, to put yourself in that other person's shoes to understand why, why don't you see this as a problem? As I see it as a problem? Why do you have a different reaction? So that's that dialogue piece that we talked about in society, the society episode that we had, that I think we're missing now, as a society, I think we're missing the compassion, the empathy, the putting yourself in somebody else's shoes, and I know I'm guilty of that, too. So I have to consciously say, Okay, this person might be having a bad day, or this person might have a different value system than I do or whatever it is just to slow down. Think about that other person and and think about it enough that you It makes you ask questions. Why do you feel that way? Why are you having that reaction? Why are you treating me that way? Talk to me.

Stasha Boyd  19:55

Well, and that's one of the things too. The values themselves are not positive or negative, you know, like you said with loyalty there's somebody that could have a loyalty as one of their primary values, and they do it in a negative way, or they do it in a positive way, you know, and a person who values loyalty in a positive way, it's like, you know, okay, I am not going to turn my back on my friend over here, who is somebody else is talking bad about them. No, I'm loyal to that person, I'm going to stand up, I'm going to put myself in an uncomfortable position to say something, or using the example at work, it's like, you know, okay, I'm, I am a loyal person, I value loyalty, but I'm going to be loyal to the company and not to the person, you know, they find themselves in a in a in an ethical conflict. And that's the difference of character. So I think that part of what we have right now is we have an issue of what is and isn't character. And I've always used the definition, that good character produces good results. If you have good character, good results are produced. If you have bad character, bad results are produced, you're going to have a just a wake of broken relationships, you're going to have a wake of financial problems, or have a wake of employment problems, health problems, whatever they are. And that idea of developing good character is what makes you choose the good or the bad side of a value.

Cheryl Stuller  21:15

So, talking about close, intimate relationships, yes. This is a big one. So how do you navigate when you are in an intimate, close relationship, or it's a parent or a sister or brother, or you know, or your best friend? How do you handle it when your values that you feel very strongly about, and that you practice as how you treat other people, how do you, how do you navigate that when that person doesn't return that for you? 

Stasha Boyd  21:56

I gotta tell you that, for me, that's a super hard one because if somebody's, both values are in conflict, or their character around those values are in conflict. Some of those, you can't, you can't fix that, you know, because people get to be who they are, they're going to do what they want to do, you cannot change other people, they can only change themselves, and they can only do it if they want to, and if what they've been doing, if their values and their character, and their reactions are serving them, but you don't like it? Well, there you are. So you have the choice, like, okay, I can either change how I look at their values, maybe there's something I don't understand, maybe there's something I don't, I'm not seeing about it. But then you go back to that question, it's like, Okay, well, is what I'm seeing, producing a good result or a bad result? Now, me just not liking something is not necessarily a bad result. There are a lot of things that I don't like in this world that are not, you know, poor character or bad. You know, it's like, like technological problems I fucking hate em', you know, it's like, but that's not actually anybody's fault, in particular. But it's, if it is something where you identify the value, that's, that's important. Like, if your value is honesty, and somebody else's value is loyalty, and they're choosing loyalty to somebody who is not you and lying about it. Now, you're in a position saying, okay, either we have to come to a conversation where you can, you're going to change that, or we have to come to a conversation about if I'm going to change that. And if neither of those things are going to happen, then we might need to, you know, cut back.

Cheryl Stuller  23:36

And that's you can easily decide that too. Because sometimes you go well, is this bad? Is it as bad as how I'm feeling about it. And I would say to you, if you are feeling like you've been punched in the gut, when something like that happens, you need to go with that initial feeling. And not two or three days later, kind of sugarcoat it, or wash over it or make excuses for it. Because if you hold those values, and this and this also comes to courage, courage to stand up for your values, whenever you can, you know, sometimes there's bigger issues like there's children involved and, and your safety or something like that. But if those issues are no longer there, and those behaviors are continuing, then you really need to look at it and say, you know, you're not honoring yourself, if you're allowing somebody else to dishonor a value that you hold near and dear to you.

Stasha Boyd  24:45

And that's why I think it's always important to, you know, and I do think you know, especially in interpersonal relationships, like marriages or family like parents and children and things like that. That's why I think counseling is important, because I do think, you know, these are, we don't understand, we don't understand emotions the same way, sometimes, we don't understand pain, we just know something hurts. And we need to know why. You know, this is painful, you know, oh, well, I put my hand on a hot stove, you know, no brainer. Other times, it's like, you know, I have this massive pain right underneath my rib cage, and I've tried not eating, it won't go away, I have tried exercise, it won't do this. And then you have to go really get into a doctor and say, Doc, I need you to help me this, this, I'm having this pain and it won't stop. And then hopefully, that doctor can help you. And they can discover what the real problem is. It's like, Oh, you know, you shouldn't be eating, you know, cow cheese. Or it might be, oh, I think we've got like some kind of a, I think I'm seeing something on an X ray, we need to talk. That's important. Because sometimes when something hurts us, all we see is the hurt. So we always I think it's always important to take a step back and say like, Okay, what exactly is the problem? Why am I really mad? Is this a solvable problem? Or is it not? And then really explore that honestly, with yourself with the other person. But on the other side of that, if it's real, it's like, you know, if you haven't come up with any justifiable reason to say like, oh, okay, I misread what they were doing, or I didn't understand their intention, then, at that point, it's like, okay, you know, I see where you are, I see what your values are, I see how you how you want to live those values. And you're going to have to go in peace and go with God, because I don't want to live that way.

Cheryl Stuller  26:33

Yes, exactly. And I think it's really important for us, going back to grit, going back to assertiveness, going back to honoring and loving yourself. Sometimes you have to let those relationships go. When, you know, there's hurt involved. When you're hurting somebody else to act out where your value system is, that's not going to work in a relationship, whether it be you know, brother, sister, Father, daughter,  whatever it is, whatever that relationship is that's not serving you in an honorable way. That's a good, that's a good way to look at should I be hanging on to this? Should I go to counseling with this person? Should I try to work it out? How many passes does somebody get, you know, go back, go back to honoring yourself and what your value system is, otherwise, you're gonna go Oh, my God, why am I doing this? This is not honoring who I am and what I think is important, you know?

Stasha Boyd  27:38

Right. And I think that's, that's part of it, and that's what we were talking about dating before and you know, how do you kind of separate the wheat from the chaff and, and This to me is true, even when you're younger and moving up. And I did not learn this until after or didn't really kind of start embracing it, I guess, until after I read my Seven Habits of Highly Effective People book, which I will forever endorse. But getting to understand that you know, you don't, when you're when you're getting to know somebody, those are the things that you're looking to get to know, you're looking to get to uncover and you know, and find out, you know, what are their values? And how do they react in certain situations? And is that something that I'm okay with, because sometimes you can have two perfectly wonderful people, both making conscientious character driven choices that are in complete opposition to one another. So an example would be somebody who's like, their, their number one value is like freedom and independence. And the other person's number one value is security and reliability. And that person who's valuing their independence is saying, you know, it's like, well, I want to be independent, I want to be able to go and and see and do, and I want you to come with me most of the time, every once in a while by myself, and the other person is saying, I want, you know security and stability. And that's what I value. And I do that by us staying home and we've really dedicated our look into our place at the house, you realize that those two people are simply not compatible. 

Cheryl Stuller  29:01

Mm hmm. I think, so as I head into potentially the dating world. I don't know where I am with that. But I think a good question to ask is, you know, instead of what's your favorite movie, or what's your favorite hobby? What's your favorite value? 

Stasha Boyd  29:19

Oh, there's a real date killer. Wow. Hey honey, yeah. 

Cheryl Stuller  29:24

You better know what your values are, dude. 

Stasha Boyd  29:27

And have your little like scorecard out, getcha a little pin, and your little hat and start like marking it down. Explain yourself, sir. And are you really gonna order that bloomin onion? Don't you care about your heart health?

Cheryl Stuller  29:41

Well, that's not a value, but I mean, seriously, how do you, how do you get into the nitty gritty of of who somebodies character is, you know, cut to the chase and get to that I think maybe having those uncomfortable, situational conversations might be good, you know.

Stasha Boyd  30:01

Yeah, but I think that's the thing, I think you can't cut to the chase. I think that if you tried to cut to the chase in that type of conversation of that depth, A you don't have the emotional intimacy and safety and security early in a dating relationship to have that conversation, you haven't earned the right to have that person expose themselves to you that deeply. You know, that that is comes over some time, and having a little bit of emotional, yeah, emotional vulnerability, and then have that being honored or respected. Okay, the next time you can do a little more the next time a little more. One of the things that I find, you know, and this is something that I don't know, if women do it the most, or men do it, I don't know, I don't care. I just know that I hate it, is people who meet you, and they instantly want to get to know your deepest, darkest secrets. I am all about intimacy. I hate small talk, and I just really, you know, I really need to find out. I was like, and I'm like, and what was your name again? And I can't see your name tag because we are actually standing in the exhibit hall of a conference. But I think it's because some people do have a they don't understand boundaries-

Cheryl Stuller  31:06

Or they tell you their life history all in one, the first night, you know, 

Stasha Boyd  31:12

Yeah, yeah, and I think part of that is- Well, and that is somebody who is either trying to, you know, like I say, cut to the chase, or trying to basically move things along, or they're just a person who doesn't respect their own boundaries, and they might not respect yours, or they don't know that they get to have them. I think that's, that's a challenging thing, too. Because, you know, when you start getting that deep into somebody's psyche, and what makes them tick, it's like, you gotta be pretty close to me to have that kind of conversation, you know, you and I have to be real good friends. Um, because if we're not, then I have to have a question with myself. Okay, how much do I trust you with that kind of information? That's the kind of information that can really be turned on a person.

Cheryl Stuller  31:57

Well, another thing that you could maybe do then is, throw out a story or a situation and say, how would you have reacted to that? Or how would you have handled that? That's another way that you can do it that can maybe maybe be less in your face, you know,

Stasha Boyd  32:14

Actually, when you're telling your life story, or when you're sharing your stories back and forth with each other, you know, and to me, I always looked at that. That's one of the things that's a value of mine is curiosity. So a person who asks you questions, you know, who you tell them a story, and they're like, Oh, really? Wow. How did that? How did that turn out? How did that feel? What did you think? Right? Um, I look for that kind of thing in people, I don't, A, in curious people, I find them very irritating. Because they know everything. And also, or they don't care about knowing anything, and that's worse. The other thing is, people who can ask a question, and then can listen to the answer. That's, that's huge for me. And then when they're telling their story, you can also use that opportunity to kind of take it back and say, Okay, what do you think, it's like, why did you make that decision, it's like, you have an opportunity, just by becoming a good conversationalist to learn more and more about people. And it's not an interrogation, it's an opportunity to learn and an opportunity for a person to, to to show you who they are. 

Cheryl Stuller  33:17

Well, and it's putting yourself in that person's shoes and showing the respect of getting to know them and being interested in them. If that's where you are, you know, sometimes you can sit down with somebody and you go, yeah, no. I don't want to. 

Stasha Boyd  33:35

Yeah sometimes it's a hard no real fast. 

Cheryl Stuller  33:37

Someone get a drink over here. 

Stasha Boyd  33:40

And next. Because, again, some things, it's like, are pretty quick, you know, somethings are so small. It's like when you see them, like you were mentioning that thing with the guy on the phone on that one date. And it's like, you know what, at our age, 

Cheryl Stuller  34:00

Exactly.

Stasha Boyd  34:01

Yeah, I'm not, we're not going for somebody who's going to relearn that. And that's something else too. I don't think anybody should ever have to be so open minded in trying to understand someone that their own brains fall out. It's like, no, that person was rude. I don't need to investigate any further. 

Cheryl Stuller  34:16

Exactly. I already know it, you know, two lunches in, you know, that's how you're being treated that way that early on? Why would you stick around for what's going to come after that, you know?

Stasha Boyd  34:27

And some things are also a matter of preference. You know, like I said, I happen to like people who are quick to laugh. I happen to like people who, who do interesting things and have something to talk about. If somebody has nothing to talk about. You know, to me, that's like going shopping and if I touch a shirt or a dress that's knit, I don't need to look at it twice because I don't like wearing knits. I already know that. I don't need to, there's nothing about me to explore. I don't have to figure that out. I don't have to understand anything about my inner psyche. I don't like it. 

Cheryl Stuller  34:30

Yeah. I'm with you on that. 

Stasha Boyd  35:00

Yeah. Or you do, I mean, you'd like people who enjoy fitness. So I think you said something earlier about, you know, something not being a value. But I do think, you know, for some people, um, physical fitness is a value, not when they're people who are like, Oh, well, they got to be hot, or they've got to be thin. But I think for some people, it's a new approach to fitness as a, as a way to take care of themselves in the future as a way to to not be a burden on other people as a way to think ahead in life. I think that's an important thing. So I can see that as a value.

Cheryl Stuller  35:37

I'm gonna think of that as a value too, because, um, I couldn't be with somebody who, you know, didn't like to work out or you know, was sedentary or, you know, we just wouldn't have enough in common.

Stasha Boyd  35:52

Yeah. The thing that really, that I always say use this as your your rudder or your dipstick, whatever you prefer, is, um, if they don't do it, or if they don't show that they have this quality, do you feel anger? Do you feel mad? It's like, right, yeah. Because it's so if that's it, then that's not a value for you. I think it's something, for somebody else that might be, it might not be one of yours. That's something I try to get into my kids heads here, the students to say, number one, your values are yours. And if nothing else, you did not learn to look at them honestly, make sure you know what they really are not what somebody else is telling you they should be. So many times I would do this exercise with the kids, I'd be like Hey, guys, I want you to take take 15 minutes and do a little bit of like thought modeling or whatever. And at the end of it, I want you to be able to write down your top three values. And I can't tell you how many students Oh, family, kindness, and you know, what another one of the virtues off the virtue list. And I would say, you know what the odds are of this random collection of people assembled in this one class in this one little College in this one town, all of y'all have in the exact same values are? However, almost all of you keep hearing those on the media, you keep hearing family values over and over again, as if anybody knows what the fuck that means, um, or at least what it means to themselves. I'm like, Okay, if say family values is yours, tell me specifically, what does that mean? 

Cheryl Stuller  37:26

Yeah. What is that? What is a family value? Yeah, I don't even know what, what, is that anything?

Stasha Boyd  37:34

Right. And you work in it, you work as a guardian ad litem, and you have, you guys are working very hard to keep families together at all times. And in almost every circumstance, you know, and you talk about, you know, those folks who do I think, like, really go down that that, again, that non character road of the good thing, like a family value? And they're like, Oh, no, those kids have to stay with that parent no matter what. And you're like, I've seen the what. No, they don't. 

Cheryl Stuller  38:03

No, they don't, no. 

Stasha Boyd  38:04

Yes, the system is not the greatest thing in the world. But it's better than that.

Cheryl Stuller  38:09

Right? Well, I'll take that back. I guess a family value could be I'm going to make decisions that benefit the health and well being of my family over drugs or alcohol or whatever, whatever it is, that's making them not a good parent. 

Stasha Boyd  38:28

Exactly. Or even. Yeah, for yourself, like, you know, because there's going to be something kind of generic like that, ask yourself, okay, how does that show up for me? Like, in me, my version of family values. And like I said, I don't even know how strong my family values are, you know, I, to me, they show up with my parents taking care of my parents, doing for them, you know. They took care of me, they raised me, they did their best, whatever mistakes they made were theirs to make up until I was 18 19 20. I carried those mistakes with me, but by the time I got to 25, 28, 30 those are mine. It's on me now. And to be angry with my parents or to be upset with anybody because, um, because of something that happened back in the day that would go with that that would not fit with my version of family values.

Cheryl Stuller  39:24

Right, right. Yeah, I'm with you. You gotta process through that shit. Yeah.

Stasha Boyd  39:32

I don't think I do not think that just because people are related by blood that they have to, that they have to get along. 

Cheryl Stuller  39:38

No! 

Stasha Boyd  39:39

Have to see each other. I mean, because you have experience with that too.

Cheryl Stuller  39:44

Yeah, I don't even talk to my brother. He's a bully. He's a bully. And I'm not gonna have that in my life. 

Stasha Boyd  39:51

Right. So if you, so if you were to like encapsulate like you said, what family values means to you, like, you value families that take care of each other. You value families that handle their responsibilities to the children, right?

Cheryl Stuller  40:07

Exactly.

Stasha Boyd  40:08

So maybe my value is not family values, it's responsibility. And, owing, I owe them. You know? 

Cheryl Stuller  40:18

Yeah, absolutely. And you love them and care about them. And you want them to be happy and healthy. And that's part of what you can do to help them be that.

Stasha Boyd  40:29

Yes. And I'm also a sunshiny person, I mean, I happen to be a pretty positive person I like to be fun to be around, I do think that there is one of my values is that it's important to, to, to be the to be, um, to not be a drag on the proceedings. So anytime you go somewhere, it's like, you're not going to be like bouncing bouncy, perky, perky, which I'm not, but I am positive, I am enthusiastic for other people. I am encouraging. I think that's one of the things that I value is and I'm thinking about how to articulate that. It's not a value of I don't believe in this like, you know, toxic positivity bullshit, where you're like, happy no matter what's going on. That's bullshit. Um, but I do think of positivity as, Oh, God, this is gonna be so hoky, because the first thing I just thought of was like that old girl scout thing, leave a place better than you found it. You know, I think that if you're gonna be part of it, if you're gonna be be with people be part of it, you know, their life should be a little better, because you're in it.

Cheryl Stuller  41:26

One of the things that my best friend does for me, and I do it too, but I now do it better because of her is if you tell her, just say you casually say, next Monday, I'm starting a new job. Well, on Monday in the morning, you'll get a text from her saying, I know, today's your first day, I hope it's a great day, I'll be thinking about you, let me know how it goes. And I just love that about her. And she's so good at it, that it's made me a better person at doing that for other people, you know, I always, of course, your children, I'm always checking in with my children. But now I'm doing it for my friends, and you know, just checking in on them. So, um, maybe that would be like empathy or something, just, you know, showing that other person that you've heard them, number one, you took in something that they said, and then you followed up and checked in on them about it. I think that's such a great thing to do for people.

Stasha Boyd  42:32

And that's actually, it's kinda like a, that'd be like a fun, you know, porch drinking game. It's like, okay, everybody. It's like, let's talk about these things that we do. And then tell us, let's narrow that down to one word, what's, what's that value? You know, what is that? Um, cuz I think that is an important one, I have a, I have another several friends, you know, and it's interesting, because a lot of my friends all have different things that they do well, that are the reason why they're my friends. One of my girls. It's like, Man, it's like, if I need something, she's my first call. If I need something done at the house, if I need a favor, if I need whatever, it's like, I'll call her and unless she is like, literally laid up in the hospital, she's like, I'm on it. And I would do the same thing for her and I have many times, because that's kind of her thing. She's an action person. I have another friend and her thing is, um, when you talk to her, you just leave the conversation feeling smarter. Feeling like, you're a better person than you are. Feeling like, you know, you, you actually thought something through better than you did. She just has the ability to, to make you, not make you, but to, um, to draw out, draw things out of you that are that are not always just positive, but are very deep and very fun and funny. And at the same at the same time. Yeah, she's I want to say she's fun and funny. It's not everything's like, you know, oh, let's talk. Um, but lots of people like that, so many people.

Cheryl Stuller  44:00

Yeah, I, I don't get that as much, but, just checking in with people, being there for them. I you, you are very good at that. You are, You are there for them, you know? And you I mean, you did it for me. You were like, you're going to be alone this weekend. I don't want you to be alone, come down, you're going to come down and you're gonna see me, and Mike. You know, um, that that speaks to what kind of person you are. Because you are very good at checking in on people and caring about them.

Stasha Boyd  44:35

And I think a lot of it is like, like you said, learning from your friends who like was like sending out those texts. I've met people who've done that and I'm like, Oh my god, that's so cool. I could totally do that. And I will. Weirdest thing that I have is that I cannot remember a birthday to save my life. I don't remember anybody's birthday. No, I don't even remember Mama's birthday. Mike remembers Mama's birthday. 

Cheryl Stuller  45:00

No mine!

Stasha Boyd  45:01

Your, well yours is different. I remember your birthday and I remember your phone number.

Cheryl Stuller  45:08

You don't remember friends birthdays, you do. 

Stasha Boyd  45:10

No, I don't. 

Cheryl Stuller  45:11

Well, mine at least. 

Stasha Boyd  45:13

Yours, I do. Um, I remember Tammy's because Tammy's is on a holiday. Tammy's is on a holiday that actually doesn't move. The day doesn't move. My brother was born on Thanksgiving. How am I supposed to remember what that day is? 

Cheryl Stuller  45:30

That's a sucky birthday. That's like having your birthday on Christmas. Yeah.

Stasha Boyd  45:37

No, his moves. So some years, it's like Thanksgiving is the 22nd. Some years it's the 24th, and sometimes it might be the 28th. And so how am I supposed to remember that? I don't know. Um, but no, it's so true. It's so true. Mike, though, he remembers them all. Everybody's, he's a savant.

Cheryl Stuller  45:57

Brian has an aunt, Aunt Kathy, whom I love. And she remembers all and there are so many cousins now. Like, there's a large, large amount. And she remembers all of their birthdays. It's crazy. She's a savant that way, I don't know how she does it. 

Stasha Boyd  46:16

Well, and I do think that that is, that goes back to that is a character, or a values thing. And maybe for that person that is friendship, it's family, it's connection, they value, that's something they value, they value people, you know, remembering people making them feel important. Um, and again, there's words for all of those things that I'm not thinking of right now. But I do think that again, going back, if something makes you angry, if you're a person who values people, you know, somebody remembering your birthday, and somebody forgets and your response is anger, then you need to figure out which value is it insulting. Is it insulting the fact that it seems like they didn't remember you and didn't honor you? Or is it insulting the idea that, you know, they didn't think you were important, and you think you're important? Whatever it is, figure out the real thing. Or what you're really upset about, what's really caused it.

Cheryl Stuller  47:10

When, when I was helping teaching the family violence class, there was a the teacher did this illustration of an iceberg. And the water, you know, coming across the iceberg, and at the top is anger. And then below the water, we're all the other emotions. So anger is a final result of feeling dismissed or hurt, or, you know, not important, like you said, or disrespected. Um, you know, that can come out as anger. So you're right, you do have to look at anger, and say, Okay, this is what I'm feeling right now. But the bottom line is, this is how I really feel.

Stasha Boyd  47:59

Right? And the other ones that come, that are, I kind of think of on that same list of anger, are guilt, shame. Um, these are all sorts of things that are basically they're, they're like, the cap on top of something else that's deeper. And when you find when you find them, you know, it's just, when you when you tap into those things, then you've got to look deeper to find out exactly what's, what's the trigger, what's the thing that's making it happen, or not making it happen, but giving rise to it? By the way, just so you know, I didn't turn my phone on? So I don't know how long we've been talking? Do you have any idea? 

Cheryl Stuller  48:36

It's ten after six, so. 

Stasha Boyd  48:38

Okay, so we're kind of, we're getting right about where we need to be. We're good, cool. I'm so proud of myself. 

Cheryl Stuller  48:44

What do we want? What do we want our warrior queens to take away from this conversation?

Stasha Boyd  48:49

Well, I think one of the things that we didn't start off with was, you know, why is this topic important to us? And why do I think it's important for for women like us, women who are, in middle age. Um, the reason I think values is important to me is because, or why I think it's important is because it's like this hidden driver, you know, we talked last week about society and how society can put this external pressure on you to conform. Your values are what presses back the other way. And so when you know what they are, and then when you cultivate the good side of them, you are stronger and stronger to push back on anything that that doesn't align with your values. And it's important for women who are our age because a lot of life is changing. Kids are growing up and leaving, a lot of people are, their their marriages are changing. People's bodies are changing and what they want in the next 25, 35, 40 years is is different. And if you don't if you've reached this point in your life and you don't understand your values, you don't know what they are, then it's really hard to pick your next direction and see what you're going to do and who you're going to evolve into. So I think it's really important for people to to have an honest assessment of who they really are. Not who they think they are, who other people have spent their life telling them they should be.

Cheryl Stuller  50:06

And I would tag on to that and say, if you want those deep and meaningful relationships, then your values have to either align or coexist. Yeah. So it's really important to figure that out with whoever you have in your inner circle, so that those relationships expand and, and they last, and they're meaningful. In the basis of all that, kind of like that picture of that glacier, the basis of all that is how your values line up.

Stasha Boyd  50:42

And make sure that you know, it's that they're complimentary, they don't have to be the same. They don't have to be, Mike and I, our, our core values are not the same. But they align very well. And we work very hard to kind of make sure that they keep aligning, and sometimes he'll do something that I can see clearly is completely aligned with his values. It doesn't bother me. So I wouldn't do it that way. I don't like it, whatever. But that's who he is. That's how he's going to be. He works it and he works it from a real positive, you know, character forward perspective. Um, I feel the same way about me, sometimes I'm going to do what I'm going to do. This is how I feel, this is what we're, this is how I'm gonna be, um, you have your choice to either be okay with it, or I don't know, go figure something else out on your own. Because that's, that's who I am. Um, I do think it's important to put a caveat on that out there. Who I am should always be positive. If you're saying who I'm, well, that's just who I am. And you're saying, Well, I'm just a bitch. That's just who I am. I'm just an asshole that yells at people, that's who I am. I'm just the person who can't be on time, shows up late, who lies to people constantly, whatever, it's who I am, people got to deal with it. It's like, no, ain't nobody has to deal with that shit.

Cheryl Stuller  52:00

Or they say, everybody makes mistakes, you know, and minimize it. If it is hurting you, then you need to take a good hard look at that relationship at that person. And if and if you are continually getting hurt, or you are continually getting dismissed or minimized, then that's a conversation that you need to have first with yourself, possibly a counselor, definitely with that person, and how they respond. And if they can change, and if they can hear what this is doing to you and respond to that in a positive way. Great. If they cannot, thank you. And next,

Stasha Boyd  52:42

Well, and that's the thing, everybody makes mistakes. But everyone has to make the same mistake every single day over and over again. That's no longer a mistake. That's choice. 

Cheryl Stuller  52:51

That's a choice. 

Stasha Boyd  52:52

And once that's started happened, now we're having a whole different conversation. 

Cheryl Stuller  52:56

And it doesn't even have to be every single day. It can be, seriously, it can't be six months ago, and now we're visiting this again, that's still not okay.

Stasha Boyd  53:07

Right. Exactly. Like I said, I think that's the thing. It's the the idea of, you know, I certainly do things that hurt other people, I don't mean to, um, at least I usually don't mean to. But if I do, and I get somebody like pointed out to me and calls it out, and you know, and I kind of take an assessment goes like, you know what, that wasn't a result that I intended to have, I did not mean for you to be hurt. Yeah, I can, I'm so sorry. And I will keep that in mind, I will change my ways for you. You know, again, that's not them changing me, that's me deciding to change something because I don't want to hurt them. 

Cheryl Stuller  53:43

Well, and you are showing that you value that person, that you value that relationship. And that's a really important thing to have known to that other person. Yeah. Because it changes the result of the hurt, it changes the result of the action. When you can honestly say, I'm sorry, I did not, you're right, I did do that. Here's what I'm going to do going forward, and then you stick to that. And if you mess up, then you admit it immediately and say, Oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. I did that again. I recognize it. I'm so sorry. Help me get on track again.

Stasha Boyd  54:24

Yeah. And I'll fix it. Not we'll fix it. I'll fix it. And I think that's a big thing too. Because going back to the whole idea of of character and values, 

Cheryl Stuller  54:34

Our sole responsibility. 

Stasha Boyd  54:36

Yeah. And I do think that that is something again, some people again, if responsibility is not one of your values, and there's nothing you can do to like make it be somebody's value, but it can be a consequence. It can be it's like okay, I'm gonna need you to take responsibility for this. I know this. I know you don't value responsibility, I get you boo. But this has to be done. Or we can't keep going on, because that that can be a consequence. And maybe that's something we should put on a different topic for another day is that idea of being able to say, okay, what's the difference between a consequence and a hostage situation? Change or else? Yeah, yeah. But I think, yeah, that's a good one.

Cheryl Stuller  55:18

And you get to decide if that person doesn't want to change that. Um, then you get to say, Okay, thank you for that information. I'm now going to do what I need to do for me. Have the courage to do that, if it's that important to you.

Stasha Boyd  55:36

Yes. And I and I, and for me, it's like going back to the whole idea, you mentioned something about parents and family earlier. Now, for me, there are things that my parents, and I guess, especially people of that older generation, do and believe and hold tight that I disagree with. I am not going to make, my respons is that, A, they get to think what they want to think. I'm not going to make an issue of it. I have friends, some of those are in that same boat. They disagree with them on something they think. What I have to ask myself is, is is this a fundamentally good person who I disagree with? Or is there something about the way they are experiencing and manifesting their values? Or in their, within their character, that I can't be a part of? That's, that's a, that's always a question. I think that's kind of a question that we were kind of touching out on society last week. 

Cheryl Stuller  56:37

And I think the litmus test for that is, is it hurting someone? Is it hurting you or someone else? If it's hurting that person, then they need to be able to look at that, and offer a change to that. And if they're not willing to change, then there you go. If you know that about that person. And you need to decide if you're going to tolerate that. And hopefully you won't, if they're hurting somebody.

Stasha Boyd  57:01

And that's the thing, too, I think, you know, sometimes we need to have a, we really need to do another show on this, this is a good, you know, sometimes, are you hurting yourself? Are they hurting you? Or are they hurting a third party? And can that third party take care of themselves? Or do they need protection? I think that's kind of like a series, a way to kind of figure out sometimes, what to how to handle somebody who you disagree with? How do you deal with when you disagree with? That's a, that's kind of a question that I have to ask a lot. 

Cheryl Stuller  57:31

Gosh, how many times have I had my friends? They're going through something? And I'm like, how can you let that person treat you that way? And they're upset about it, but they're not upset to the point that they're going to make that person do anything different. And then you kind of have to go, okay. I mean, if you're, if you're allowing this to happen, and you're okay with that, even though I see it as Wow, you have to you have to let that person decide that for themselves.

Stasha Boyd  58:01

Well, but here's the thing. The reason they do that, is because they they're putting all the responsibility for fixing the situation on that other person. If you change, I'll be okay. If they would just change. I know, they're an asshole. I know they're mean to me. I know they're rude. I know they're stealing from me. I know they're lying to me. And if they would just stop that that would make everything okay. Rather than saying, Okay, I know they're stealing. I know they're lying. I know, they're being mean. And you know what I'm going to change. I'm not going to be here. I'm going to move out.

Cheryl Stuller  58:31

I'm going to make a different decision. 

Stasha Boyd  58:33

But if they're waiting, if you're spending all your time waiting on somebody else, and again, so folks know, this is not values, it's all about something else right now. But if you are if the answer to your problem is somebody else doing something, you're in for a world of hurt.

Cheryl Stuller  58:48

It kind of is value, because you have to love and value yourself enough that you're going to say, I love you. But you are not treating me in a way that honors and respects me. And you're not going to change that. So I need to change this situation, this relationship, this living condition, whatever it is. I'm going to value and love myself enough that I'm not going to allow this to happen anymore. And part of it, too. I think it's not just, you're having somebody else change. I think it's you're not valuing yourself enough along with you're putting that change on that other person.

Stasha Boyd  59:27

I agree. I think you're right about that. I think that it's also that idea that the value is you can say, Okay, I can see that you don't have the value of not hurting other people, or you know, or, but you don't value our relationship. You don't value my health and happiness, you know, or whatever that is and says, okay, so I am clearly not of value to you. And if that's the case, why are you making your, why are you making them valuable to you? 

Cheryl Stuller  59:53

Right, right. Yep, I agree.

Stasha Boyd  59:58

There we go. All right. So what are we doing next week, Cheryl because we just we solved this one, we're done. We got this. 

Cheryl Stuller  1:00:03

This was a great one. I loved this one. 

Stasha Boyd  1:00:06

Yeah, I kind of liked it. 

Cheryl Stuller  1:00:08

I kind of liked it too. Um, I don't know. 

Stasha Boyd  1:00:11

Well, we we're supposed to do goals this week we can like launch into that one next week or we can come up with a different topic.

Cheryl Stuller  1:00:17

Okay, well, let's leave the listeners in suspense. 

Stasha Boyd  1:00:24

Alright everybody, we're in suspense, we're either going to do goals, like we promised you with our last recording, or we're gonna do something totally different. You don't know. But as always, thank you all so very much. We really appreciate it. Cheryl, tell em what you want. 

Cheryl Stuller  1:00:38

Follow us and like and, you know, follow if you, if you follow the podcast, then it'll send you those latest episodes to your feed. So and share and comment and if you guys would do that, that would really help us out a lot. 

Stasha Boyd  1:00:57

And also tell us what you want us to talk about. So you know, or, or if you have questions about something we already said. So pop that in there too. Alright, everyone, thank you so much. We love you from the bottom of our hearts and we're gonna get out of here.

Cheryl Stuller  1:01:10

Have a great week, everybody.

Stasha Boyd  1:01:12

 Bye.